Raymond Camden's Blog Rss

Lost for May 9 - "His name is Jacob"

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Posted in | Posted on 05-09-2007 | 6,868 views

Holy. Crap. Ok, so I'm hooked again. I can't remember the last time I about broke my remote hitting pause and play to try to grab a screen shot. This episode was absolutely amazing. I won't do a normal review of all the events but just talk about the high points.

First and foremost - I believe others on this blog have mentioned that perhaps a third group was involved. Now we have proof. Ben was responsible (along with this other group) for massacring the Dharma Initiative. These "natives" apparently didn't care for the Dharma folks - but I wonder why? As far as we can see, the Dharma folks are a bunch of hippie scientists. In the past we had seen them kill people whey they needed to, but now we know that those acts were commited by the Natives (I vote we call them that).

The whole encounter in the hut with Jacob. Part of me didn't like it. It felt a like a basic horror flick. But - it was kinda cool. This brings up the whole whispers thing. I don't think we've had the whispers since season one. Are the Natives some kind of psychic power? Spirits?

Who is Jacob? Ghost of a Dharma employee? A spirit from the Island? Why would Ben be able to talk to him and need to ask Locke what he heard? Or is Ben crazy - knows he is crazy - and thinks Locke really heard something?

Anyone think the mass killing is the "Incident" referred to in the video from season 2? But the scientist there in the video was a Dharma guy, so that wouldn't make sense. Unless Dharma sent more folks in later on.

Who here thinks Juliette is really helping out? I maybe believe it. Her reactions to Ben make sense now if she realizes Ben is crazy. Oh, and when Jack said he was thinking about what to do, and that was his excuse for not saying anything, I felt like screaming.

I'm kinda getting the feeling that Dharma went to the Island because they knew something was a bit special there. But the Island is far more powerful, and dangerous, then they expected. At this point, maybe Dharma is not even close to being involved anymore, and what we have is basically a super freaky Island (ok, not the best name) as the main protagonist?

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Raymond Camden said on 05-09-2007 at 10:34 PM #
A quick comment. Did you notice how shook up Locke was when he saw the mass grave? Some great acting there.
Scott P said on 05-09-2007 at 10:41 PM #
The gas explains what happened to the Dharma folks but I still wonder how did Ben get to be in charge? And where did the natives come from?

It makes some since that this was the incident that was referred to, think about this: Dharma sent others in to findout where their folks were. Ben is good at manipulating others so he could have convinced the search party from Dharma that something horrible happened and they gave him the authority.

He (Ben) has made contact with folks off the island - the video of the red soxs winning it and Juliette's sister on playground.

Being a workman and smart, he would have been around folks doing real work so he could have picked up enough knowledge on how to keep the place going.

Really - really good episode. And Lockes not dead. Him and starbuck are coming back.
Scott P said on 05-09-2007 at 10:45 PM #
OT - the guy playing Baltar need to win some awards. He is amazing, like the scene in prision when he started talking in that dialect the throaty gravely one then right back into his polished speaking style.


Sorry - back to lost again...
Scott P said on 05-09-2007 at 10:50 PM #
From Ray:

Consider this. Ben is real.
Everyone else in the other group (I'm calling them Natives) are...
fake... spirits... what have you. But Ben is 'real'.

SP - Was Ben's mom the smoke monster like the dude from OZs brother, the priest?

R - I think so.
Dave Knapik said on 05-10-2007 at 5:36 AM #
Hiya Ray,

I love your blog and CF projects, and I'm also a big "Lost" fan. I also really like that you mix pop culture content with professional content because it's fun and more people really should do it.

However, I read your blog daily via RSS and I watch "Lost" weekly and sometimes I read your blog for CF-related posts before I get around to watching "Lost". I'm a very spoiler-sensitive geek, so I was really unhappy to check my CF RSS feeds today and see "His name is Jacob" and the opening preview sentence to your post. I find it kind of a spoiler, however minor, and that's just not cool. I don't expect to have to watch out for "Lost" spoilers when I just want to catch up on insightful ColdFusion writings.

Perhaps you could just entitle "Lost"-related posts generically as "Lost for May 9" or "Lost s03e20" or what not, and maybe include a "spoiler warning" text at the start of it before launching into "Holy. Crap....", etc.? I like to go into episodes not knowing anything about them and now I've got a set of pre-conceived notions and I'm bummed out. I don't want to accidentally read anything more, so I'm going to have to skip reading your blog today and come back once I've watched "Lost", which is disappointing.

Sorry for the long comment, just wanted to say that I do like your blog and your pop culture writings, but please try to spare us the spoilers, however light, or warn us first somehow.
Raymond Camden said on 05-10-2007 at 6:03 AM #
Dave, all of my Losts posts are spoilers. All of them. So this wasn't new. I can see your point about the title... but if you knew nothing about the episode I don't see how it could reveal much. But - that being said - next time I'll just keep it to the title.
Jim Priest said on 05-10-2007 at 7:28 AM #
I'm more confused now than ever. The same guy that tells Ben (as a young boy) to 'be patient' is the same guy who gave Locke the file on Sawyer (and he doesn't really appear to have aged any)... Maybe the 'Natives' can't harm anyone but have to get others to do their bidding?

So maybe the spirits angle isn't far off. But apparently there are a 'mix' of people on the island - the 'Natives' and then people like Ben and Juliette (and the crash survivors) from 'outside'.

I just wish the TV folks could work out some kind of rotating schedule so at least one cool show could be on instead of all of them ending with a long dry spell til new episodes.
Doug McCaughan said on 05-10-2007 at 8:04 AM #
I did a frame by frame of the cabin scene. The flash of the person we see in Jacob's chair is Ben. Compare the profile to just after the scene as Ben walks out of the cabin.
Alex said on 05-10-2007 at 8:19 AM #
I don't think the quick image of Jacob was Ben. I froze that frame, and the facial hair alone was more than Ben had.

Also, how did Ben pick himself up and throw himself against the wall like that?!

JACOB IS REAL! ;-)
RobW said on 05-10-2007 at 9:51 AM #
Via thefuselage.com, a lightened up screenshot of Jacob:
http://picasaweb.google.com/imfromthepast/InProgre...
Raymond Camden said on 05-10-2007 at 9:54 AM #
Omg, its Obi Wan!

;)

That _is_ a cloak, right?
RobW said on 05-10-2007 at 9:54 AM #
Oh, and I think I spent a good ten minutes with my mouth hanging open after last nights episode. They did a good job of making Ben look nutso, then Locke hears "Help me". I also think Ben can see Jacob, but he can't hear him. Perhaps he can read his lips or something, but Locke being able to hear him was a big threat to him.
RobW said on 05-10-2007 at 9:56 AM #
I don't think its a cloak, but he seems to be dressed similarly to Richard when Ben first met him in the jungle, like someone who might have been crew on the Black Rock.
Adrian J. Moreno said on 05-10-2007 at 9:59 AM #
You can see Jacob in the cabin here:
http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Jacob

Speculation is that his profile matches Locke more than anyone.
Joshua Curtiss said on 05-10-2007 at 11:04 AM #
"What was that in there?"

"That was Jacob."

Lol, great stuff.
Dan Sorensen said on 05-10-2007 at 11:27 AM #
I don't watch Lost. I've tried a couple times but I've never found it to be as compelling as these great blog posts on the subject and the follow-up speculation in the comments, spoilers and all. :-) I'm intrigued by this mystery shared second-hand.
Joe Zack said on 05-10-2007 at 12:10 PM #
I had a feeling something bad was going to happen to Locke this episode, he was so...sure of himself through most of the episode bossing around the "others" and such.

I really hope we don't lose him, he's probably my favourite character.

Also, my curiosity is really piqued over the "natives", they look pretty not-native to me!
Raymond Camden said on 05-10-2007 at 12:15 PM #
@Joe: I'm pretty sure they are natives. More than once they made reference to the fact that they were the original inhabitants. It was mentioned that Dharma didn't know how ot live with them.

I get the feeling though that any problems were more misunderstanding. I can't see a bunch of hippies going in and being violent to natural inhabitants. I CAN see something going wrong and things turning violent, if that makes sense.
Jonathan said on 05-10-2007 at 12:19 PM #
and the one creepy other apparently has not aged in the last 40 years. has anyone mentioned that?

I am no longer trying to figure the show out. I am just enjoying it. the jacob thing was so delightfully over the top. I wass laughing my ass off.
Jim Priest said on 05-10-2007 at 12:29 PM #
Those 'hippie scientists' had some kind of gas that wiped out a whole islands population so I don't know how much John Lennon they were listening too... :)

Dr. Richard Alpert is the Other who Ben speaks to as a young boy and later advises Locke (and who doesn't appear to age): http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Richard_Alpert
Russ Johnson said on 05-10-2007 at 12:49 PM #
Did anyone else catch the "Roger Work Man" bit? A few weeks ago in the episode where Hurley finds the VW bus in the Jungle and they drive it down the hill, the guy in the bus was wearing the coveralls and it said "Roger Work Man" on it. they found Bens dad, that was awesome how they pulled that back in.

I dont think Locke will die either. Especially not with the way the island heals people.

My favorite scene of Lost EVER was last night when Locke jumped on that eye patch guy and started beating his ass. Ben starts freaking and calls for Tom and Richard to do something and Tom just casually shrugs his shoulders and takes a drink of his coffee. Incredible!

I think Ben is definitely threatend by Locke. Thats why he shoots him. Especially after Locke nailed him as a liar.

Jacks character is starting to annoy me though. Im glad they are letting Sawyers character evolve more.
Ryan said on 05-10-2007 at 1:01 PM #
Jacob, is the guy from Green Mile, that greeted them on the island, when Ben and his dad first came. Also, was there when Ben was born. If you look closely
Raymond Camden said on 05-10-2007 at 1:03 PM #
Ryan, no, the guy who greeted them died. Ben walked by his corpse.
Russ Johnson said on 05-10-2007 at 1:13 PM #
Yeah.. Ben walked by and looked at him sitting dead on the bench and then reached over and pulled his eyes closed.
Ryan said on 05-10-2007 at 2:38 PM #
But, if the island, can bring people back to life?
Russ Johnson said on 05-10-2007 at 2:43 PM #
Didnt we watch the eye-patch guy (mikael?) die in the sonic, make your ears bleed and foam at the mouth fence when Locke pushed him into it?

I believe they even checked his pulse after climbing over the fence to verify he was dead.

Also, when he ran into Desmond and the gang in the jungle and they pulled the gun on him, he made the comment that he had already died once that day and didnt want to do it again.

Not to mention, I dont think Locke was dead when they showed him last, he was still breathing while laying in that ditch.
Dave Knapik said on 05-10-2007 at 4:33 PM #
Thanks for the reply, Ray. Just got round to watching the episode and, yeah, you're totally right, the little bit I read of your post gave nothing away.

I didn't mean to discourage you from writing about stuff or tell you what to do on your own blog, just explaining things from the point-of-view of spoiler-spazzes like myself. Had this been an in-person conversation instead of a blog conversation, I'd have simply plugged my ears and closed my eyes whilst singing "no spoilers no spoilers no spoilers no spoilers" really fast. ;)

If you can keep the titles generic, I'll try to steer clear of your Lost posts until I've caught up with it.

Now that's out of the way... holy crap! A Ben flashback!?!?

As my wife has pointed out, why are The Natives of this island in the middle of the ocean white and have such perfect American accents? How do they have U.S.-based resources and fronts like Mittelos Bioscience since they aren't linked to Dharma? Not so Native, I'd say...
Raymond Camden said on 05-10-2007 at 4:36 PM #
First - let me address how they can have American accents. I think it is the same reason they can look like Ben's mom and Jack's dad. Remember the smoke monster can look into your past. If the smoke monster and the Natives are one - then we have a force that can read your mind. Therefore it is trivial to look and sound like something you are familiar with.

Second - Maybe Dharma isn't really sure what is going on the Island. Maybe they don't know about the massacre. Maybe they DO know but are working with tne Natives because... who knows - for power - money - whatever.
Raymond Camden said on 05-10-2007 at 9:27 PM #
So I showed this to my wife:

http://losteastereggs.blogspot.com/2007/05/11-fram...

I told my wife - doesn't htat look like a cloak on his head. But then she made the observation that it looks more like one of those old powered wigs.

Now if this is a spirit - and perhaps from the Black Rock - then that could make sense, could it not?
Scott Stroz said on 05-10-2007 at 9:37 PM #
For the record, the term used to reference what Ray is calling the 'natives' was actually the 'Hostiles'.
Raymond Camden said on 05-10-2007 at 10:01 PM #
Errr, no. Dharma called them the Hostiles. I'm calling them the Natives, which I think is a bit more descriptive, and works better since it clarifies that they were at the island first.
Scott Stroz said on 05-10-2007 at 10:11 PM #
I can't remember, who said the 'hostiles' were there first?

Cause if it was Ben or Dahrma, can we really trust the info is accurate?
Russ Johnson said on 05-10-2007 at 10:15 PM #
@Scott

Actually when they showed the scene of little Ben turning off the fence and running into the jungle and he sees the Richard character and wants to go with him, the Richard guys says that the Dharma people cant get along with the islands original inhabitants.
Scott Stroz said on 05-10-2007 at 10:24 PM #
Still doesn't prove they are 'native' to the island. They could very well have landed on the island just as some of the others did.

Also, still doesn't mean its true.

Lastly, how was dude able to get all clean shaven?
Russ Johnson said on 05-10-2007 at 10:29 PM #
Oh I dont think they are 'native' to the island. Not in the sense that Native is usually thought of. But I dont think thats what Ray is implying either. I do believe they were there before Dharma.

I believe they had something to do with the Black Rock. Probably the crew and the island is preventing them from aging. And like Ben said, some of the others were brought to the island like Juliette.
Scott Stroz said on 05-11-2007 at 4:43 AM #
I am not sure I completely buy the 'people don't get older' theory. Ben did.
Raymond Camden said on 05-11-2007 at 5:42 AM #
I think you can take Native a few ways. Native can mean they are from there. If you take that meaning, then NO one is native from anywhere but Africa. Or you take it in the sense of 'been here long enough where they might as well be native'). I mean shoot, even the Native Americans walked over here, right?
Joe Zack said on 05-11-2007 at 9:42 AM #
I think of native as meaning being "born" there. Supposing they're some sort of spectral citizens that can manifest themselves in ways familiar to "us", what made Richard change his hair?

=)
Hatem Jaber said on 05-11-2007 at 10:37 AM #
I think that Ben lost his connection with the island and with Jacob and he was faking the conversation with him in front of locke. If Ben was able to hear Jacob he would have heard him say "help me", only Locke heard that. Another thing, Ben can't let the others know that he lost his connection with the island, that's why he shot Locke.
Rick Root said on 05-11-2007 at 12:33 PM #
At the end of the episode, my wife seemed to think that locke was dead.

I said "Did you see him die?"

She said "Well sort of!"

I said "Did you SEE him die?"

She thought she saw "the light go out of his eyes"

I don't think so though.

Ben tried to kill him because if Locke can talk to "Jacob", then Ben won't necessarily lead the group anymore. The other native seemed to think that Locke was special, and Ben didn't want him to be special.

Ben killed his own father, and that made *HIM* special - or so he thinks - so he tried to get Locke to do it, and Ben knew that Locke couldn't kill his own father.

But the other native told Locke he could get help, so Locke had Sawyer kill his father.

Now, the natives must consider Locke to be special too.. and given that he seemed to hear Jacob say something.. then that kinda proves it.

But how will Locke survive a gunshot wound to the chest, laying in a pit of decaying corpses? who knows.

Anything can happen on this island.
Rick Root said on 05-11-2007 at 12:53 PM #
My wife just told me her sister heard that they're actually going to end the series this year, and release a movie, and that'll be the end of it.

I'd go see the movie =)
Jim Priest said on 05-11-2007 at 12:59 PM #
I think the Lost folks are going til 2010.

http://www.abcmedianet.com/assets/pr%5Chtml/050707...

I did see today on Slashdot this will probably be the last season for Battlestar though :(
Scott P said on 05-12-2007 at 10:28 AM #
For the one or two that missed this on digg:

http://www.lostreview.com/2007/05/another-theory-o...
Raymond Camden said on 05-12-2007 at 10:44 AM #
Site is down - but it is cool that is CF.
Jago said on 05-14-2009 at 1:35 PM #
The problem with the first scene, in which Jacob and the other guy have American accents is that at that time the American accent wouldn't have existed.
So the question still remains... Why do they have American accents?
Raymond Camden said on 05-14-2009 at 1:38 PM #
Um, did you mean the May 13th, 2009 episode Jago? This blog entyr is two years old. :)

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